Meet Daybreak Labs Commercial Real Estate Advisor: Brian Wilson, Vice President, Colliers

Host Yolanda Fintschenko, Executive Director of Daybreak Labs and i-GATE Innovation Hub, home of the Startup Tri-Valley (STV) Initiative, sits down with Brian Wilson, Vice President of Office R&D and Clean Facilities for Colliers International and Commercial Real Estate Advisor for Daybreak Labs. In this compelling conversation, Brian shares his unique journey from practicing real estate and construction law in Silicon Valley to becoming a key architect of the Tri-Valley's hard tech and life sciences startup ecosystem.

Tune in or watch the link to YouTube to learn about the unique advantages of the Tri-Valley startup ecosystem.

Transcript

This is the Startup Tri-Valley Podcast, featuring in-depth conversations with the leaders who are making the Tri-Valley the go-to ecosystem for science-based startups. I'm Yolanda Fintschenko from Startup Tri-Valley.

Today we have with us Brian Wilson, Vice President of Office R&D, and Clean Facilities for Colliers International and Daybreak Labs Commercial Real Estate Advisor. Brian, welcome to the pod. 

Thank you for having me. It's privilege. I appreciate it. 

So I feel like I've known you a long time and yet somehow, I don't know this: tell me and the audience about how you came to be doing what you're doing now professionally? 

I was happily practicing law. I was practicing real estate and construction law in Silicon Valley. And I was representing real estate developers, users, various companies, and I wanted to get a little bit deeper into the transaction. I had folks telling me, you should think about commercial real estate brokerage as opposed to just practicing law. I really considered it and thought about it more and concurrently I was practicing law in the in Silicon Valley and I wanted to be sort of closer to home and work a little bit more in my backyard because we were living in Pleasanton at the time and I was commuting into Silicon Valley. So just kind of started asking around, shopping around to brokerage firms and talking about my skillset my experience and just trying to find the right sort of landing spot for myself. I found a good firm to work with and landed there, and that's kind of how I got into it. 

Yeah, that's great. 

And just for our audience, can you explain what real estate brokerage is and how that's different from real estate law? 

Yeah, so real estate brokerage is really just that it's brokering the deal.

And more on the front end. So just whether it's acquiring space for lease or acquiring space to purchase and acquire, it's brokering a deal between a landlord developer or a tenant user or between a seller and a buyer within commercial real estate.

And, what I particularly focus on is clean facilities or any sort of facilities that have a controlled environment or advanced facilities, particularly in MEP. So mechanical, electrical, or plumbing. And that's kind of where I live and that's been my sort of specialized skillset.

That's fantastic. 

Thank you. 

Yeah. how does that, how did doing that kind of work bring you in touch with i-Gate and getting so involved in helping us build the startup ecosystem here in the Tri-Valley? 

Yeah, good question. It's funny to think back on that with all of our past and our experiences.

But and I did, going into this, I thought back on it and when I made the pivot from practicing real estate and construction law to real estate brokerage I was able to parlay some of my existing relationships with clients. but a lot of it was just ground up and more organic build, and so I got entrenched in the ecosystem and I really had to do some diving into to understand who some of the players in the ecosystem were particularly in life sciences and hard tech. Again, because that was my focus. And then got in touch with Brandon Cardwell. And then Brandon got me in touch with you and then Hitch, and then it just, organically built from there. but it's finding folks who are players and connectors and collaborators and passionate and like to build and collaborate and connect.

Right. So that's how I kind of got involved there. 

Right. I remember that because I was still volunteering with iGATE and I was doing EastBay Bio Network and I know you were very helpful to us with several events. And currently are a co-organizer of our Startup Tri-Valley Life Sciences Summit and have been for years now.

Yeah, it's been a labor of love. And for people who don't know, Brandon Cardwell was executive director of iGATE when you met him. He's now the director of innovation and Economic Development for the City of Livermore. And Hitch is Greg Hitchen founder and co-founder and managing director for Tri-Valley Ventures.

And both, Pivotal people in building the startup Tri-Valley ecosystem. 

Yes. So let's talk, you've touched on how you kind of got connected and trying to basically build your connections into the sort of space that is most influenced by needing commercial real estate that have controlled, engineered environments. Talk a little bit about, obviously there was a business connection, but you've done way more than the labor of love. 

The labor of love, and it's been everything from helping with events, but I think most importantly, it was professional relationship as well. talk a little bit about how you were able to kind of use all that knowledge to actually help us start daybreak Labs in its new space. And so for maybe talk a little bit about what we were coming from. Yeah. And what we were trying to come to and what a huge leap that was to go from a co-working space that was mainly focused on office to a coworking space that had purpose-built lab space to actually create a hard tech incubator. Well, was this and during the pandemic? 

Yeah. Oh my God, you're making me shake thinking about it again because it took us over a year and a half to actually secure space going from it was a switch at the time, right?

Yeah, and then Brandon got the cease and system anyways, but, so it was the switch at the time and it was mostly office with questionable lab in the basement. but with Brandon we connected and he came to me, he was like, Hey, you know, we would like to have purpose-built lab.

And he came to me because that was my bailiwick, that was my strike zone. But also he wanted to find existing lab infrastructure. And that can be difficult to find sometimes. And hence why it took a while. And also, we didn't end up finding something that was existing Lab had to be built out. But then, you know, part of the exercise too is finding a landlord who will do it especially when you don't have significant revenue generating credit. We call an industry a credit tenant, so it's more difficult to build that out, and the credit tenant here being iGATE as a non-profit. Well, being a non-credit. 

 I mean, it's nice to have municipal funds. Right. You know what I mean? So That's nice. Too. So that's great. Right. Plus you, I, I believe you get, uh, your fiscal year's, two years out, right?

Yes. So, or you get budgeting, um, budget for two years out. So that's great. So anyways, so, um, so yeah, and that was during the pandemic. I think we started in the middle of 2020. So like that's right when the pandemic hit and we looked at everything out there. and Janelle helped out too, right?

So Janelle, Our Daybreak labs advisor for operations. 

Yeah, So she helped us. She would come look at facilities and because a lot of it is, again, MEP, mechanical, electrical, plumbing, and just seeing what would, what currently existed, what infrastructure currently existed to understand, how we can expand or piggyback on those Existing infrastructure to build out the lab that we need. So they can have legitimate, viable lab for these startups and so we finally landed at where we were. Daybreak Labs is now at SouthFront  in East Livermore. And, but even then it was tough to get the landlord to build out the lab that we needed. but it was having everyone involved, like you and Janelle and others.  it definitely was a team effort.  But, and then also part of that deal was again this is Brandon and me and just folks collaborating. And sort of critically thinking a little bit. Part of getting that deal done was actually getting two other users, S2Genomics and Buzzkill labs also needing lab. Because they didn't have lab over there at the time. No, do you remember? 

Yeah. I remember. Yes. I remember when there was, there just, it was all office. There was no walls. Well It was all office, yeah. So that current landlord had just acquired the asset. And wasn't sure exactly what they wanted to do with it. And we convinced them to do that conversion that folks were talking about at the time. Early pandemic, right? But it was still early in that process of office conversion to lab. 

we pretty much occupied or leased the three users, the almost the entire floor there and so we kind of collectively bargained. And that was a little unique strategy with Daybreak Labs and kind of S2Genomics leading that charge.

Right. And then BuzzkillLabs was a smaller user, so didn't have much leverage or bargaining to power. we did it. And, gosh, I think we signed in March of 2022, and then the build out was finished, I think in like September. Of that year? September of 2023. Yeah. Was it? I thought it was 2020.

Yeah. Okay. Maybe it was. Yeah, September was 2022. Yeah, you're right, you're right. Gosh, it's been a long time. 

I know. 

It's not long. And also long. 

Yeah. So, but that was great. It was such a joy to be a part of that, and that was part of me. Just again. Trying to get entrenched in the ecosystem.

And showing, folks, this is what I can do and the value that I can bring, and Brandon was also asking me at the time, I remember he wanted to do marketing materials for the Tri-Valley. And talking about the life sciences ecosystem at the time and talking about the lab inventory.

at that time I was one of the only ones tracking lab inventory. And so that was helpful for him too. so anyways, yeah, it was a great project. And it was a privilege to be a part of it. 

Well, and we literally would not be here without you, Brian. So thank you. 

I know that was a huge motivator in terms of inviting you to be a Daybreak Labs advisor for our companies. And so for our listeners who may not be aware of Daybreak Labs is the Tri Valley's first and only Heart Tech incubator. It is, as Brian said, over in East Livermore and offers about 2,500 square feet of shared lab coworking space and additional office space as well.

And it can house, it's capable of supporting life sciences and other hard tech companies like Climate Tech and Deep Tech. so these are really early stage companies. It’s designed to help companies that are seed and pre-seed. So they're not yet at a point where they're seeking private space.But of course our goal in incubating them is that they raise their next round and are driven by their goals and the requirements of their investors. To seek private space here in the Tri-Valley. And that's what inspired us to ask you to be a Daybreak Labs advisor in commercial real estate because space planning is something that, especially a technical founder may not be thinking of while they're still de-risking their technology in the lab. But it's super important. So can you talk a little bit about why you advise companies and how you advise companies for Daybreak. 

Yes. you're right. So, to piggyback on what you just said, they don't technical, they don't really think about it, and frankly, they shouldn't. and that's what I tell my clients, particularly younger startup clients, you focus on ip, you focus on product development or developing your services, whether it's product or services. You focus on that and I'll help you find space and we'll work through it, right? So we'll work through from building out a. A space program.

So understanding the programming for the functions of your space, and then building out a space plan to take those functions and put it together into a space plan. and then let's figure how much space you need and what type of infrastructure you need. and then we go out there and find it.

but for the startup founders at Daybreak Labs that I've helped and advised. sure. Some of it is. Okay, you're ready to graduate from the space. Let's go out there and find you space and do the things we just talked about, building out a space program, space plan. Survey, tour, lease negotiation, build out space, you know, occupy and operate. So there's been some of that, but a lot of it has just been, you know, I like to say with my background as an attorney, I just like to problem solve. and just, help assist.

Like you give me an issue a problem that you have, and we'll go out and problem solve. And that goes back to what we talked about in this community is just having connectors, collaborators. And a lot of it is. If they have a question, I'll connect them with, if I can't answer it, then I'll connect them with someone who can. And just being like, I've developed a network of professionals over the years, that can assist with all different types of issues, particularly for science-based companies. Whether that's particular kind of permitting with. The certain government agency or jurisdiction or, a certain kind of special build out or special needs for a controlled environment, whether it's engineering services or architectural services to even, fractional CFOs. and so they provide,  they ask me, they tell me the problem or issue that they have, and I go out there and try to connect them. If I can't do it, then connect them with someone who can. And again, that's just all part of the collaborative network that we have at Daybreak Labs and, and the Tri-Valley.

That's great.  So you're, what I hear you saying is you're definitely inviting companies to lean on your expertise so they don't have to try and acquire that expertise in house. And then, but at the same time. it's a long play working with an early stage company.They may be talking to you, hopefully they're talking to you a couple years before they need space. But, it may be a good like three to five years before any of these companies have raised enough that they can justify having space. And what it sounds like you're doing in the meantime is just offering them your expertise and your network.

Yes. that can help them answer questions. That could even be, we had a question at one point of if we were asking for some confidence. That we truly had the space configured the correct way for BSL two and you were able to connect us to a WB engineering and they were able to tour the facility and, you know, basically confirm that everything was exactly the way it needed to be and they were also willing to do that at no charge, which was great for a nonprofit like us. And I think that it seems like you're really resourceful in connecting other service providers that also want to build relationships. Exactly. With early stage companies who may just be asking at this point so they can write the costs in to their budget. When they go to raise their next round. 

I try to work with and I try to build a network of professionals that are incredibly competent in what they do and they're also willing to see the big picture at times and maybe provide some services upfront for, to have a relationship for the long run. Because especially if it's for a startup launching at a Daybreak Labs or any startup for that matter, just not needing that much space. I mean, that isn't the deal.

Right. Or the transaction that you are hoping for. Right. It's somewhere down the road. and so a lot of the network that I build, they understand that and see that and appreciate that too 

So one of the things that strikes me is, Janelle mentioned this in her podcast is,  there are things, space sounds very, when you're talking about startups in an ecosystem, like can sound like one of the least sexy parts, right? Of building your ecosystem. but the reality is if your region doesn't have the right space, you are not going to be able to support growth of startups, even if they can start where you are. So it's one of the most critical factors. And I'm curious if you can talk a little bit about, first of all, for the founders who want to stay in the Tri-Valley.

Yeah. if you can talk a little bit about it. Especially if they're in hard tech, if they're life sciences, climate tech, um, the, the prospects for them to find space here in the Tri-Valley.  And then also like the timelines. So if you're, you know, say you've raised your pre-seed and maybe you're raising your seed.

And you kind of have like, okay, maybe in three years I'll have my seed raised and I'll be somewhere between Seed and series A. So when should a company start talking to you?  particularly if they're here in the Tri-Valley. They like being in the Tri-Valley. They want to grow in the Tri-Valley.

And then what, you know, what are they, are they going to be able to find the space that they need to grow?  So, well there's a few questions there. So, like, first, I mean, it is unequivocal every time I'm talking to particularly a founder. I mean, as companies mature, they understand and appreciate they need to come to me or start looking for real estate earlier, but they think, my lease isn't expiring until nine months or six months out, I'm fine. I got time. And you know, my response to them is, no, we should be looking at things right now, looking at space. And understanding you should be talking to me and we should be understanding your space needs and your infrastructure needs and it's all free, so I mean, we should talk about it, you know? Right. So, but anything under, like my rule of thumb is anything under 10,000 square feet, you should probably look, be looking and start the conversation and start preliminary tours and surveys, about a year out and then, anything bigger than that, it depends, but let's call it, 18 months to two years. especially if you're going ground up. If you're building ground up. You know, it should be two to three years out and it all depends if there's significant power needs, with the power impacts that we're having in the Bay Area, I mean, it should be three years out. if you're needing something above five megawatts of power. So, anyway, so it really depends but. Especially for daybreak lab startups. It really is like 12 months out. And that, and it's a good thing. It gives us, again, a chance to sort of understand your space needs and your infrastructure needs. And it gives me the opportunity to go out there and show you what exists. Because the dilemma is being able to Find adequate space that can accommodate your special needs, right?

Whether the clean environment that you need, it's clean room, whether it's Biolab. whether it's fab fabrication, is going out and finding that space because being a startup typically this stuff is, that type of infrastructure is expensive to build. when it's expensive to build, the landlord will say, okay, well give us some term, right? So give us, five years or maybe if it's a significant build out right, then it's, give us seven years, but you don't want. To give that much time  In term, right? You want two years, three years.

You know, to get to your next milestone, to reach your next milestone Or your next funding round. so there's that dilemma. So the best thing that you can do as a startup Is find space that has that existing infrastructure as close as possible, right? To accommodate your needs and again, so that's why it's important to reach out early. And often and really let me do that work for you. Plus you also get to see, it's kind of funny. A lot of my clients, by the end of the transaction, they'll feel like they're real estate experts just because we've seen so many spaces. And just different iterations of space, right? And then for different price points and different landlords and different lease terms. so, you get to see what's out there and how quickly space that you need is being leased up or not. So, it's just a good benchmark.

That's great. So, start early and often what I'm really hearing though is that if you are putting the time into planning for your company and reaching out to someone Early on you're going to be able to find the space that you need, the controlled engineered environment, either existing Or built out Yes. with, either enough time or money. So giving you enough lead time to find the turnkey space or enough money to do the build out. Exactly. and so that the answer is yes, you can absolutely grow into whatever controlled, engineered space Yes. That you need here in the Tri Valley.

Look! It either exists or it doesn't. And if it doesn't, there is enough sort of supply and, there is motivation from the landlords to make a deal and get it done. the one thing I will say though, and this is, sorry I'm skipping ahead here, but something to look out for in the future when you talk about what's something that you think may be a problem for the next five years is, we've been hit a little bit in the all markets have with life sciences. and there's been a decent amount of give back space for bio lab.Which means there is space out there, so that's great. but if your particular space doesn't exist, then there may be some reticence from the landlord, right? To build it out and I've done so much groundwork in over the years, and it was easier during the pandemic, right?

Because there was a lot of lease velocity for life science companies. but just telling these landlords, build it out. Build it and they will come or build it and you'll get multiple generations. Multiple users. it'll have residual value, you know, if you build it out. And then now that they have built out some space and they've had some give back, I'm probably going to have to go back to square one to explaining, Hey. Build it out and you know, you got shadow space or you have available space, right. Build that out and, and let's do this deal. Right. So that may be an issue, but right.

Let me handle that. Right. So, right. I'll handle that. And it sounds like too, that the beauty of controlled engineered spaces is that there's some transferability. So just because one industry is flagging, if you have another growth industry that the fundamentals of what people need is things like the MEP, right?

 And so that’s true also if you're a physics based company or if you're a fabrication company. So someone who needs to control their HVAC could just as easily be an Unchained Labs or bright Silicon Technologies, right? Or Vector Atomic. so I think one example is representing one of my clients is Vector Atomic. They're in the quantum sensor space. And, they, we ended up leasing a facility that was previously occupied. Unchain Labs, there's a lot of Biolab. or other just, laboratory rooms, controlled environment rooms. and we're able to convert. A lot of those, because, and again, it goes back to meps. It goes to what you're trying to control. Is it humidity? Is it cleanliness? Particle count, right? is it temperature? And we can adjust some of those, some of that infrastructure, some of those controls, the lab infrastructure, and convert that.

A different use. And, that's what we're able to do there. So I mean, yes, there's, crossover and that's why, you know, I don't just do bio lab. Right. Or I just don't do chemical lab. Right. it's Controlled environments, and advanced, advanced facilities. And then there's going to be crossover between different kind of users and you can take advantage of that.

And that's great for those early-stage companies Yeah. That are looking for that, you know, two-to-three-year lease because 

They're more likely to find something in a situation where you have one industry where there's kind of give back. and if they're not in that industry, then they can take advantage of, that existing footprint. And one thing I've tried to explain too, to landlords is, Let them come. And, and see the big picture because once companies come to the Tri-Valley, they typically stay and they plant a flag. And so if we do give them the opportunity two, three year lease, let them reach that milestone or let them show validation and then get a secure additional funding. Then they'll go from 2000 square feet to 10 to 15 To 30 to 40. Maybe become next 10X genomics. But it's important that the community needs to appreciate that and understand that 

That's great. Well, so you've talked a little bit about how you've been helping companies and certainly how you help Daybreak Labs. what really motivated you to donate this much time? Like I get it at the beginning. You know, you don't know, you don't know people. You’re forging connections. What's held you and kept you. you're more than just helping people get into space. I feel like if any of our members just needs to talk to someone, they could contact you and say, 

I'm also a therapist. Yes. 

No, You're a connector. And you're doing a lot more than just Connecting people to space. So I'm curious, what's keeping you going? Why so deep? Brian? 

you're right, because it is a decent amount of time. you know, I'm passionate about it, and it is great. It is so rewarding seeing these companies grow, you know, and just being a part of it. I don't want to just parachute in for a deal and walk away. You know, I tell everyone, Hey, I'm soup to nuts start to finish. And then also then after that, after you're in the space, let's strategize for the next space. Right. and really understand space needs and growth patterns. but it is, it's so rewarding to see these companies succeed. they do so much more. And, just building an ecosystem, building a community, employing people And their families, and providing sustenance. I mean, it really is, that's what these companies do and just to be a part of is exciting. And you never know, right.

Like, you never know who the next entrepreneur's going to be. And that's what's great about the, yes, we have some serial entrepreneurs. But we also have first timers with a great idea or a good ip. And just run with it, you know? And they were maybe just a scientist.

At their last job. I don't want to say just a scientist, but they were a scientist and now they want to be an entrepreneur. And it's cool to connect them or, and they're all so intelligent, And I'm working with all these intelligent people, but just being able to help them with a connection or find a solution.

For their problem that I just happen to have, just because I've been around, you know, for a while. Right. And doing these for these companies. Right. But just to be able to make that connection or solve that problem, it's incredibly rewarding. And just to work with the other collaborators.

Collaborators in the community. such as yourself. But everyone, and even listening to, I listened to Janelle’s, podcast too, and just hearing some of her stories and just laughing. At them and, you know, putting together the lab benches Right. At Daybreak Labs after we did that's what I'm talking about. Full service soup to nuts. Brian Wilson. But you know, we would do the deal, the deal's done, but you know, we got lab benches that weren't put together to save a couple bucks and then, well, they got to. Be put together. They're not going to put together themselves.

 So helping out with that was a long day with you and Janelle. It was a long couple days and there was no air conditioning. 

So it's a great story. So it's cool. And it's turned to a story that we're talking about on a podcast now. So I think every time we walk into the lab and I kind of flash back to that picture where there's no walls and then there's just several of us just building benches. So it's been a great ride and I hope it continues to be. and again, so I love working with companies’ founders. I mean all different, folks within the organizations and also just the fellow collaborators too.

It's a great community. And even listening to Sam Rads Yes. Podcast on here too. Right. But that's one thing that he said before he was even in the community, I invited him to some events and, and, he went and just welcomed with open arms and, had some questions and, got answers from folks in the community and, it's a great community that we have here, I think. 

I think so too. And I think what makes it great is that we're building it. So we're building a community. Of course we're inviting people like Sam Rad to join us. But we're building a community for ourselves.

Right. And I think that comes across loud and clear from you and others. Whether they're entrepreneurs or advisors or both. Is that they're you all are building the community you want to work in and that you want to live in. So, well, let me actually circle back on something too. 'cause when I was in Silicon Valley, I would go to events. Right, because I'm always trying to be involved. Right. I have no connection there. This is after we'd already moved from Silicon Valley to Pleasanton. And I'm like, why am I going to these things?

You know, like I don't. Really care that much, I'm sorry. But then I started going to some events in the Tri-Valley and I was like, we got like a cool little ecosystem. this was after Quantum Life and but like creating that flywheel. 

It was starting to happen. And it was really neat to see. So yes, you talk about. Creating this community and look at, I don't know if I'm creating anything. I just want to be a part of it. And I want, I've always said, my mantra is, rising tide raises all ships. 

And I think that's what we're doing.

it's cool to see the ecosystem grow, and it's cool to do things like the Tri-Valley Life Sciences Summit and broadcast what we're doing to folks outside the community. And people inside the community Right. To help validate it. So it, it's cool to see, I always say this is cool to see in my backyard.

This is my community And I want to lift it up , Being or do what I can to lift it up. Being a contributor is I think that's what we see is I feel like everyone who's working in the startup Tri-Valley ecosystem wants to be a contributor and they, and there's some personal pride in it because that what they're contributing to their community and it's contagious. So I guarantee now that Sam Rad has had been offered up so much help and services coming into the community with his, hisa startup life foundry, now I think he's going to return the favor.Actually, I know he already has. Yes. But same thing. Right. It's just contagious. so it's cool. 

No, that's great. so I'm curious, you've advised several companies, daybreak Labs. What has surprised you the most aboutyour experience as advisor?

What surprised me the most really is. Is the amount of information that like clients will give to me. And maybe it's just because, I'm able to connect them or Help solve a problem. But even as an attorney I feel like companies or C-suite, kind of. Keep you at a distance, right? Because of billable hours. Or, They'd only want to share so much. But, as a commercial real estate advisor, it's, you know hear everything I, and you know, it's just they tell me about their strategy on a go forward basis, and it's also helpful for me to do my job too.

Right? Is cause then we can look out, like I said, 1224 months In advance. And really understand sort of space needs, especially if they're starting to scale and commercialize, right. Because then we can get into manufacturing or other different business units. But, so that's been a little surprising to me.

but it's great, it's welcome. So, keeping transparent folks. Well, and maybe it's a little bit a pull, not just athe sense that you give that you're there to help them solve all their problems., it probably invites like, well, , I'm going to share what's.

What's on my mind right now? Just in case Brian knows someone. That's probably it, you know? No good deed goes unpunished. 

Right. So, you've talked a little bit about this, I think in your explanation about what why you feel such a strong pull to contribute, but what do you love about living and working in the Tri-Valley?

Well, kind of just that, like living and working in the Tri-Valley. but look look, I love the Tri-Valley. I think we have so many resources and such a precious community here. it's just the makeup of the Tri-Valley is great with respect to, we got such a mature and robust workforce. we have strong companies, we have, you know, legacy Companies as well as younger companies that are up and coming, and scaling and building revenue. and we also got a nice little brain trust, right? And a lot of government resources from both national lab labs, Lawrence Livermore National Labs in Sandia. again, just the community of collaborators and just over my short span here, I'll say. Just see the growth and collaboration that, I've already seen. In such a short, I say a short span of time, but it’s been a good amount.

just say, how long has it been? Yeah it's been a while, but, again, that's rewarding to see, you and that's what I appreciate is Living here, working here. And, being a part of. It's growth, you know? that's incredibly, that's incredibly rewarding to me.

that's what I love. 

That's fantastic. Yeah. So you mentioned a little bit a challenge as an industry leader and a co builder of the, the Tri-Valley startup ecosystem. What do you see as the upcoming next few years challenges and opportunities? For a region.

 So challenges, it kind of goes back to what I said before. A little bit about you know, having to influence and persuade certain landlords to build the lab. Or just controlled environment, just Advanced infrastructure for these smaller deals Or Questionable credit, just startup credit companies. and then now to get some of that space back, that's been tough for them. so, to basically persuade them, 'cause there is, there's a lot more activity In the market for lab and clean space. So that's been positive. So anyway, so persuading them to do this. So let's build it out again on shorter term leases. That may be more success because that's a big burn. It's a big burn for these companies.For their lease obligation. so there's that. So, and maybe, public funding just with some of the pullbacks from the federal government. I think that may sting a little bit with nih. 'cause it's not everyone thinks it's, this is all private funding. Vc, you know, a lot of it is, a lot of it is, you know, federal Or even state, but just public funding as well. it's some sort of gap fill, Sothat may be an issue for startups. As you get larger, that's, that's probably not going to be an issue and then opportunities, I mean, there's again, there's space now 'cause there's been a decent amount of give back. So there is space. So if you need space, if you need lab space, come out here and let's talk and, we'll see if you can land something. Especially, I mean, we have, a reasonable, I don't like to say cheap, but reasonable, rental rates out here as well, so and good space. So a lot of this stuff is newer product, you know, whereas you get some old legacy space, in certain other markets, you know? Right.  So I think there's some opportunity there. 

That's fantastic. 

So, and I think some other opportunities is, I think you're going to start seeing, we talked about Quanta life for a little bit. And that flywheel that was created, I think you'll probably see that with other mature companies That have maybe come out of that flywheel. Like 10XGenomics

There's already been some spinoffs. Out of there. And I think that. You're going to see another fly. Well, I think that we just have a viable flywheel now. And I think you'll start seeing, younger companies. I mean, that was our first sort of homegrown unicorn.10X genomics, I think it's time. Let's have another 

I think we will see that. And it not necessarily gonna be in life sciences either. 

Well, I was thinking our other unicorn was ai. Right. and that's, you know, another one where you are the original founder's already founding another company. And expect to see hopefully some more companies coming out of that. I am starting to see more Companies in lasers, photonics. Advanced optics. Advanced manufacturing. 

 That's very hopeful. 

so kind of pivoting from the broader to the narrower.

 can you talk a little bit about What are the attributes of a good advisor for Daybreak Labs? So for people who don't know, we have a network of advisors like Janelle,  Brian, they may advise us as an organization But they also advise our companies.  And so you advise our companies. 

Yeah. And you've gotten a chance to interact with our advisors and we're hopefully going to get every single one of them on the pod. can you talk a little bit about what you think makes a good Daybreak Labs advisor?

I think first of all, knowing your skill set or strike zone. You know, and but also, and mine being in clean facilities, commercial real estate, but also understanding, appreciating not just limiting, limiting that. You know, and just really understanding that you can provide other services or value again, with just Opening up your network. Or connecting, you know what I mean? and that, you know, thinking, I don't know if they're going to need my skillset or something. like still come and Find out. Come reach out to, and see if there's a need. For that particular skillset. but again, it's really just one, understanding your particular skillset, but then also understanding that you have other skills and you can provide other value to these companies as well. And just be willing to talk and listen to them. And because sometimes they just don't know they, they have a problem and they just need to figure it out.

And sometimes they don't know which advisor to reach out to. Right. So either I'll like, send, Hey, maybe you should speak to this advisor. Or I'll reach out to another advisor and be like, Hey, let's, this is an issue. that this individual's having, like, how can we solve this for them? 

And so. Again, there's that collaborative nature and just, , leave your pride at the door a little bit. You know what I mean? With some of this stuff. just doing everything you can to help these companies. 'cause that's what we're trying to do is like, see them succeed.

and then again, once you start here, they typically stay here. 

Right. 

You know? Right. So. Yeah. So again, it's a win. It's surprising the tide, right? For the Tri-Valley, you know? So, 

so it sounds like some of the secret sauce of being a good advisor is having that, the heart for it you're here to build, you're here to contribute. Understanding what your unique strength is for that a startup can have and recognize that there may be other strengths that they wind up leaning on. Yeah. And then being willing to lean on another advisor when you realize like, wow, this is a problem that needs. To be solved, and I'm not sure I can solve it or help them in the way that they were thinking. and opening, and leave your pride out the door and being willing to say like it's not going to be me But here's who you should talk to. 

I mean, that's all part of it, right? It's problem solving and it's putting together the puzzle for them. 

I love it. Yeah. Keeping your eye on the problem's. The same advice that advisors get. Right? Become the expert in the problem. 

So, I mean, it's true. That's why it's a saying. 

And what do you think is the value of Daybreak Labs to founders and to building the startup ecosystem in the Tri-Valley?

I mean, it's what we talked about with that burn, right. That burn is so precious for these companies, and so being able to provide. Um, space at a discount and not committing to three, five years, God forbid. You know what I mean?. So you have an opportunity to generate data or validate.

Your IP or whatever it is you are trying to, creating the product to develop or, , and also the equipment, right? Because that equipment is expensiveSo being able to use and, and piggyback off of that equipment, I think is important for them. Again, controlling the burn. and then also just you. Just the collaborative network. The community. It's not just the advisors, by the way, like even the residents. You know what I mean? The other companies, they all collaborate. You know, and like sometimes like I'll see at other incubators, I'm not going to say any names, but you know, people are protecting their ip, you know?

And signing confidentiality, you know, and I feel like with Daybreak it's a lot of collaborating. I'm actually seeing these kind of results. What do you think I can do? Or what do you think I can change? Or what do you think I should be, should control for?

And you see a lot of that. and it's great, just having like Friday afternoon pitches And getting feedback from everyone. in the community with advisors and also residents and stuff. I think all that's important. And, you even got George Farquar who just love being a part of the community. And it goes both ways. He loves asking questions and loves providing solutions Or advice. So, all that's, I think it's incredibly, valuable these companies 'cause I talk to them, but for those companies who aren't there that's the value that you can glean from it, For being a part of Daybreak Labs. 

That's amazing. It still comes down to community. is there anything that I didn't ask you that you'd like to talk about? 

No, we covered everything, right? Whole gamut too, I think we covered everything and I think my sort of passion for the community comes out and what I do and how I just love to help these companies through any stage of the business cycle, whether it's these startups to public companies, it's something, I enjoy doing and being a part of. And, I hope this community just, you know, continues to grow and expand and the companies that do benefit from Daybreak Labs, and the sort of startup community give back, you know?

and then again, it's kind of just keep creating this flywheel. 

. Building, we're building that virtuous cycle. I think so. 

well great. Well thank you so much Brian. Thank you for all you do for Daybreak Labs, as a co-organizer for Startup Tri Valleys.

Life Sciences Summit that's coming up on October 15th. and all the things you're doing in between. Yeah. So thank you and thank you for being on the podcast. 

It's a labor of love.

Thank you. It's an honor to be a part of the podcast and be a part of Daybreak Labs and the ecosystem, so thank you.